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Nov 30 2011>, "FW: William Joseph Dowler,"
Carolyn Hawkins manderly_hk@hotmail.com
11/30/11
to me
Hi Cliff
Following is the email.
Since then I have discovered that William Joseph Dowler and May Willcocks had three children, twins Joan and Kenneth, and a daughter Mary. Joan married Hershal (Jerry) Mayall, and have two children David and Janet, Ken married Daisy and have three daughters, Carol, Mary and Denise. Mary married John Horswood and they do not appear to have any children. Mary is trying to retrieve from a niece some family albums that disappeared when her parents died.
If she sends me pictures, and if I get her permission, would you like any copies, or is this spreading your net too wide?
Best wishes
Carolyn
From: manderly_hk@hotmail.com
To: cliff.gittens@gmail.com
CC: pollymair@btinternet.com
Subject: William Joseph Dowler
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 18:27:42 +0800
Hi Cliff
Yes, it is William Joseph Dowler, 1891 - 1973, who was married to May Willcocks, 1893 - 1974. They had twins, Joan and a boy whose name I could not get over the 'phone, and a girl, Mary, who I spoke to last night.
Her father went to Mollie's funeral in the south of England from his home in Grimsby (that was some journey in those days) but stayed outside and did not speak to my mother. Mary knew that my father was in the Royal Air Force, and the story goes that William was worried about my father's reaction. I do not understand the reason for any of this and nor did my mother. Apparently William was the black sheep of the family. He fell out with his mother, Annie Abbott (although Mary's nephew, who also contacted me via Ancestry.com last night, called her his stepmother - the mystery thickens) and he moved away from London and the family after the First World War and went to live in Grimsby in the north of England where he married May in 1919, and lived the rest of his life.
It was quite amazing to speak to Mary last night. She is calling my mother today - I have not warned her and I hope the shock is not too much for her!!
Mary did say that it was her fault that the family did not keep in touch after Mollie's death. I obviously told her not to be silly, but she said she felt really guilty and was going to apologise to my mother. There was obviously a lot of bad feeling among the members of the Dowler family. I doubt I will ever get to the bottom of this, and my mother is definitely unaware of any of it. I have a funny feeling that they may have felt that their little Minnie Etta left for Canada and a better life, and they might very well have been envious. They must have felt that she had a charmed existence, living and traveling around Europe, while they were stuck in pre-war England. Perhaps they were also in awe of my father, who I must say was an extremely handsome fighter pilot during the war. He also came from a good family - father a solicitor, mother's family with their own thriving businesses in London. Who knows - perhaps I am reading too much into this.
I did ask her about her Uncle, William's brother, Edwin Cecil Dowler (1889 - 1971) who also emigrated to Canada. I have photographs of him in Phillipsburg, Ontario, with his son Edwin (apparently he had 5 children). He was the one that my mother thought was in the RCMP. I have discovered through my research that he enlisted in the 21st Lancers in 1905, declaring he was 18 although he was only 16, married in 1912, went to Aberdeen, Scotland, where he served in the MILITARY MOUNTED POLICE (this must have been my mother's RCMP!), and then left for Canada. He returned once, to my knowledge, in 1960 to stay with his brother William Joseph in Grimsby and then returned to Canada, and died on 9 February 1971 at a place called St Anne de Bellevue, Montreal. Mary tells me that he fell out (what a family for disputes!) with his son Edwin and they subsequently never spoke again.
Anyway, Mary comes down to the south once a year, and I have made her promise to let us know when she comes next time and we will meet up. Anyway, I have now have a first cousin, once removed!
Best wishes
Carolyn
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 20:15:56 -0800
Subject: Re: [Gittens & Johnson Families Online] Please moderate: "A life Sketch - Henry Selman Leach (1891-1975)"
From: cliff.gittens@gmail.com
To: manderly_hk@hotmail.com
Hi Carolyn,
It pretty amazing how all of this family re-connection is happening for you and your mother.
Mary referred to her father as Joseph. The closest to Joseph that I have is Willie J. Dowler, I am assuming that the J. stands for Joseph. Can you clarify this for me?
Thanks
Cliff G.
Cliff Gittens
Surrey, BC , Canada
cliff.gittens@gmail.com | www.gittensfamily.ca
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2011/11/24 Carolyn Hawkins
Hi Cliff
thank you so much for this. By chance at exactly the same moment I received an email from Mary's nephew so I have contacted both of them with information. I have identified Mary's parents on my tree. Amazing!!
I believe they live in the north of England so there is little chance of meeting, but nevertheless we are at least in contact.
Best wishes
Carolyn
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 09:49:57 -0800
Subject: Re: [Gittens & Johnson Families Online] Please moderate: "A life Sketch - Henry Selman Leach (1891-1975)"
From: cliff.gittens@gmail.com
To: wordpress@blog.gittensfamily.ca
CC: nonniemair@gmail.com; manderly_hk@hotmail.com
Dear Mary,
Thank you for your inquiry on my web site. Although I am not directly related to Minnie (Dowler) Leach I have been in touch with her daughter Barbara and Barbara's daughter Carolyn via e-mail. I have copied them both with this e-mail and included their respective e-mail addresses below:
Barbara Ellen Clinckett (Leach) Mair e-mail address is nonniemair@gmail.com
Carolyn (Mair) Hawkins e-mail address is manderly_hk@hotmail.com
With this information you should be able to contact one another.
I am sure this will be a welcome surprise for everyone after having no contact since 1949.
Warmest regards to all.
Cliff Gittens
Surrey, BC , Canada
cliff.gittens@gmail.com | www.gittensfamily.ca
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On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 8:05 AM, WordPress wrote:
A new comment on the post "A life Sketch - Henry Selman Leach (1891-1975)" is waiting for your approval
http://blog.gittensfamily.ca/archives/454
Author : Mary Horswood nee Dowler (IP: 81.104.203.64 , cpc1-grim4-0-0-cust831.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com)
E-mail : john.horswood@ntlworld.com
URL :
Whois : http://whois.arin.net/rest/ip/81.104.203.64
Comment:
If your mother was Barbara Ellen Clinkett Mair, would it be possible to get in touch with her as I am her cousin Mary Horswood nee Dowler. her mother Minnie was my fathers[Joseph] sister. The last time I heard from her it would be about 1949. |
